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Badmans Tropical Fish Message Center:
General message area: Clown Loach
February 21, 2002 - 01:57 pm
I have a 58 gallon tank. I had to buy 2 small common plecos
to clean the tank.(And I must say they are very entertaining.)
Can I safely add 2 clown loach and maybe a o-cat (to
eat my hair algae)?
I also have 3 guppies, 2 platys, several young platys not
babies, 6 neons. My tank has finished cycling. I added baby
angels, they died one by one over a week. That was very
hard to watch them die and not be able to help. My ph is
8.0. (yes I did aclimatize my angels over a hour, slowly
adding my tank water to their water)
My water tests negative for amonia and nitrites, I may have
5.0 nitrates the colors are so close it is hard to tell.
Here is my question: What fish could I have in my water
with my ph so high? I can't afford to do the osmosis
February 21, 2002 - 06:08 pm
Clown loaches do not like that high of Ph. I wouldn't
try adding them. Since your ph is high i did some research
( at www.petmad.com/fish/fish_advice_faq.jsp) and
it says you could keep a gourami or swordtail A gourami
is very nice and you can get dwarf ones so the wont get
to big and aggresive against little fish like your neon
tetras. I think you should leave the question of oto cats
up to Kick or Joyce they are very good and knoligable.
February 21, 2002 - 06:43 pm
Your pH is quite high, even for straight tap water. Do you
have any lfs in your local area (same water supply)?
If they don't alter their water and you don't alter
yours then you should be right. The fish will be used to
a high pH. So you don't neccesarily have to change the
pH your water. The angels probably didn't die from high
pH (unless you got them from a lfs that has a much lower
pH in their tanks). Even though your tank is cycled
it is still a 'new' tank and angels tend not to
do well in tanks that are less than 6 months old. (But
you did the right thing by aclimatizing them slowly - keep
doing this with all your fish new fish.) Same goes for
rams, several tetra species (neon, cardinal, rummy-nose)
and a few other fishes (e.g elephant-nose). So if
you want angels you will have to wait. In the mean time
you can add some clown loaches (I recommend three)
and don't add anymore bottom feeders as the common plecs
get very large (up to 12 inches, I think). Not sure
about oto cats, though. I've never had them but from
what I've heard they are very sensitive to water conditions
and tend to just . . . well . . . die after being introduced
into a new tank You will have to wait until you tank is
a bit older (say 6 months) until you get them and
when you do get them try to find a lfs with the same pH
Other fish you can put in your tank are:
* The hardier tetra species (black widow, penguin,
head'n'tail light, serpea, silvertip, black neon,
bloodfin, pristella, lamp-eye, glowlight) Neons are
generally not considered hardy, so good I hope yours do
* Cyprinids - all barbs and danios.
* Paradise fish and gouramis (but not the fussy
ones like the chocolate and croaking gourami). I don't
recommend bettas as they are not good community fish (even
though they would tolerate the pH)
* You may even be able to have mollies (and not
have to salt the tank). Mollies will actually do well
in fresh water as long as the pH and hardness is high (and
the water quality is perfect!)
* I know I said before 'no more bottom feeders'
but I have to put in a good word for cories - cute fish,
* Rainbowfish! (if you can find them) - any
of the Glossolepsis and Melanoteania species will do well
in your water (they actually prefer it).
* Another cichlid you could have is the Kribensis -
an African cichlid (but not Rift Lake) that tolarates
a variety of water conditions.
Have you considered trying a Rift Lake setup? Your water
conditions are perfect for it! Some one else can adivise
you on this though because I don't know much about it.
All the adivce I have given you is for if you DON'T
change your water chemistry. If you wish to change it I'm
sure someone will post on how to do it sucessfully (I
have never done it myself)
Anyway, sorry for the long post but I felt like talking
and you gave me the perfect oportunity!
February 21, 2002 - 06:50 pm
Lenard's post wasn't up before I posted mine. So
I'll say this - he is right about clown loaches not
liking that high pH. But if you can find a local LFS that
has clown loaches acclimatized to high pH water (similar
to yours) you can get away with it. But this goes for
all the fish I recommended - most of them (apart from
Rift Lake ciclids) do NOT come waters with a pH this
high in the wild. But due to being bred over many generations
in captivity they have gotten used to different water chemistry.
I really hope you can find a LFS with similar water to yours
as this will make fish keeping a whole lot easier for you.
February 22, 2002 - 08:29 am
I agree with Sierra on the angel part. When I first tried
angels in a new tank I had a high mortality rate. My current
angels are all about 5 years old now, so the aged tank of
over six months really did make a difference. Angels West
hatchery on the web breeds angels at about 8.0, so it is
possible to keep them at a high ph. Angels are pretty adaptable
to ph, unless you are dealing with wild caught angels which
are really differnt fish than the common ones in LFS stores.
As far as the otto go they are IMO more sensitive than angels
and will have problems in your tank. They prefer a planted
tank and do better in a small group.They're cute little
fish, but not particularily hardy and might have some problems
with a really high ph. Neons are also pretty sensitive fish
and I never could keep them alive very long, so good luck
to you with them. I had green swords years ago and they
are really attractive fish. Some people I know with Rift
Lake tanks actually do add rainbow fish, so I know they
will do well at the higher ph.
February 22, 2002 - 05:52 pm
Clown loaches can do fine in that high of pH water and be
very happy, i know many cichlid fanatics that keep them
in the same tanks all the time. As for your plecos getting
big, don't even worry about that now..if you want more
bottom feeders, add them. There is no reason to not buy
a fish you want because a pleco will be a foot long in 5
years. And there is a simple solution to that...just take
the pleco the pet store when its too big and buy smaller
ones, you will even make money out of the situation.
February 23, 2002 - 08:15 am
Scout, are you totally confused now with all the information
you have received? One telling you not to add clowns, the
others saying it is okay? There is such an over abundance
of info here that even my head is spinning. Email me, and
I will help you.
February 27, 2002 - 09:38 pm
Thanks everybody for your help.